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Secrets To Scale Podcast
048 - Changing Your Selling Mindset With Paul Ross

048 – Changing Your Selling Mindset With Paul Ross

Secrets To Scale is a marketing and entrepreneurship podcast that revolves around hearing the stories of successful entrepreneurs and uncovering their secrets to scaling their businesses. Music for every episode of this podcast was written and produced by Treycen Clausse.

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Tanner:

This week on the show speaker and author, Paul Ross, joins me to talk about changing your selling mindset. Paul has some really insightful tips on how to approach sales in a way that keeps your prospects engaged. You definitely don’t want to miss out on this episode. So stick around.

Welcome to the show, Paul, I’m really excited to have you. Go ahead and introduce yourself to the audience.

Paul:

Thank you. My name is Paul Ross. My mission is to take already successful six and seven figure salespeople, entrepreneurs, business owners, and show them how to skyrocket the results. Make their best day seem like a average day, jumpstart their own personal best and crush the competition if they’re so minded by using the power of subconscious communication, because it’s my belief and the experience of thousands of my students said it is the subconscious that makes the decisions. Most importantly, the buying decisions, including the decisions you’re going to sell yourself on about your sense of possibility and what you deserve and what you can achieve and enjoying your life.

Tanner:

So, Paul, how did you, how’d you get started? How did your career get going? Have you always been in sales?

Paul:

I actually, well, I don’t put this in my bio, in my one sheet. I like to spring it on the host. So you ready for a surprise?

Tanner:

Absolutely.

Paul:

I am a former dating coach.

Tanner:

Oh, wow.

Paul:

For guys who are like 30, 40, 50 years old, never had a date in their life. And so I had to learn how to sell them on the idea that they could change and then help them with their terrible mindsets, as you can imagine, and then teach them to communicate with women in ways that were evocative and emotionally exciting. In essence, the most important sale of your life is a date, right? You’ve got to prepare your marketing. You got to do your prospecting. You’ve got to qualify the prospect. Do your sales presentation, answer objections, do your trial close and get referrals or repeat business to be vulgar about it. I hope that analogy. Well, I don’t care if I offend too many people unintentionally, I’m not for everybody. I will say that right out of the shoot. So that’s how I got my start. And I began to see how this could generalize into sales in general and turn up. That’s what I’ve been doing. I really love it. And it is a passion of mine. I have an ulterior motive, Tanner and all of these, all of my presentations, all of my teaching, which is I want people to fall in love with language. It’s powered to sell, influence persuade, turn stumbling blocks into stepping stones and pain into passion. That’s what I’m jazzed about because it is the structure of our consciousness and shapes our decisions and drives our behavior. And it’s pretty cool stuff.

Tanner:

Well, I’m really excited to get into that. And I have to say, I really liked the analogy made. Made me chuckle a little bit.

Paul:

Thank you.

Tanner:

So, Paul, what do you think has made you successful throughout your career?

Paul:

Driving curiosity. I am relentlessly curious and hopelessly creative. I just am curious about the way the human mind works. I can’t stop that curiosity. The more I learn, the more I discover how much there is yet to learn. And I’ve always been a creative person. I cannot stop creating new material. I cannot stop creating new ways of looking at the world and teaching. It’s just, it’s just who I am. I’ve always been this way and there’s nothing else I know how to do. I don’t know. I can’t. It’s true. I can’t draw, I can’t paint. I can’t build a building. I can’t drive a fire truck. Those are all beautiful things. I don’t know how to do it. This is the only thing I know how to do

You’re never selling yourself or your product or your service. You’re always selling decisions and good feelings about decisions.

Tanner:

Well. So, let’s get into the mindset of things. Since you’re an expert in that. So when it comes to sales, I mean, what do you think needs to change with our mindset and how we approach it?

Paul:

Sure. Well, first and foremost, I think we need to have a mindset that’s uninvested and process oriented. Let me talk about what that means. And to wield the twin sorts of humor and outcome independence. So let me unpack that for you. What do I mean by being uninvested? I would like to put it like this. You’re invested in your skills, but you’re just interested in the sale. In a breakfast of bacon and eggs, the pig is invested. The chicken is interested. So when I look at champions, I see champions are invested in their skills. They’re invested in constant improvement. Yes, they want to win, they’re ready to win, they’re practicing to win, but ultimately they’re process oriented. So I think this is the first thing that you have to get.

The second thing you have to get is when you know how to do it properly, selling. I think selling is fun. I think sales can be one of the most fun things that you can do if you understand it in a radically different way. To me, you see selling, you’re never selling yourself or your product or your service. You’re always selling decisions and good feelings about decisions. And that is a matter of addressing the subconscious mind because it’s the subconscious mind that makes most of the decisions that is 80% of any decision-making process and addressing that can be tons of fun. When you know how to use suggestion and metaphor and stories, it can be a lot of fun because you can see the wheels and the other person’s head turning and you understand what you’re doing. They don’t understand it. They don’t get it consciously, but they’re being driven and led and moved by you to go where you want them to go. And to me, that can be a riotously fun, a fun activity to do.

Tanner:

So when it comes to, you know, speaking to the subconscious, you mentioned story and metaphors, could you elaborate a little bit more on that?

Paul:

Sure. So I can do it with you. I can give you an example just teaching you.

Tanner:

Okay.

Paul:

If you’d like me to. So I’m going to give you a metaphor here. We have a current of electricity that we want to conduct. And we have a sheet of gold foil and a sheet of cardboard. It’s not a trick question. Which one is going to conduct the electricity better?

Tanner:

I would think the gold.

Paul:

The gold foil. Okay. When you go to influence your prospect, think of your words as being the electricity, but the state of mind, you want your prospect to be in, as being the conductive medium, the gold foil. Do you want them in the cardboard state of being bored, of not really tuned into what you have to say, of feeling overwhelmed, of not trusting themselves? Or do you want them in the state where they trust you, where they feel like you’re their chosen leader, where they trust themselves to make a good decision, where their focused, where they’re excited. Which do you want? Or do you want them to stay where they’re bored, distracted, don’t believe you, cynical, have too many other things on their mind. So just by using that illustration, I make my point much easier to understand. Does that make sense?

Selling is about creating states of consciousness.

Tanner:

Yes, absolutely. And I, I think that was very well done. And, and I agree with you. I think state of mind and trust is really everything when it comes to sales, because, you know, if you catch a prospect at a bad time when they’re in a bad mood and they just don’t want to listen to you, your odds of making a sell are way lower. Right?

Paul:

Of course. So that’s the first thing I teach. See, I teach radically, look, if you want to get radically better results, you have to do more than have a different playbook. You have to have a radically different way of understanding thee game. To me selling is about creating states of consciousness. It’s about two things. It’s about using suggestion to get your ideas in the prospect’s mind, but it’s also about expanding their mind to include your ideas, because the idea that your prospect knows what’s best for them is a, just a false and far too optimistic view of human nature. You’re laughing because, I don’t know, that score to hit with you. How did that score hit with you?

Tanner:

Well, I just think there’s a lot of truth to that, because you know, more oftentimes than not, the human mind is kind of just wired to, you know, stay away from spending their money. Right. And you know, that’s a natural thing for them. And so you have to, like you said, kind of rewire the way they think about things and, you know, get them to really understand the value proposition that’s at play.

Paul:

Correct.

Whatever you can get your prospect to imagine for themselves would be perceived by them as being their own idea.

Tanner:

So Paul, what are the four words you can use in the first minute of a sales presentation to create immediate and unbreakable rapport and trust.

Paul:

Those words are, gimme your money now.

Tanner:

I love it.

Paul:

No. So, I’ll give you those words, but as a teacher, I always want to teach the concepts first. The idea being that once again, if you can, whatever you can get your prospect to imagine for themselves would be perceived by them as being their own idea. And therefore they will not resist it. Now, there are a few ways to do that. You can use suggestion, which is another topic. You can imply things correct. Or you can be very, very vague, so they fill in the blanks. We’re going to talk about the second one, implying things. If I imply something, you’re more likely to accept it than if I stat it directly. So these are what I call implied relationship words. Let me unpack it for you.

In a typical sales presentation someone would say something like, so I’m about to present my marketing plan to you. You’re going to see, for example, if it was real estate. You’re going to see how we sold 15 homes in your neighborhood at 10% above the average price we’ve been in business and have blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And your buyer, your whatever, their eyes glaze over and like (snoring sounds), or they just don’t believe it or who cares. That’s nice. But instead I teach the following. Before we explore our marketing plan together. So before, before we, not before I, but before we. We implies, but doesn’t state a relationship. Does that make sense? We’re doing, it’s a shared activity. Before we explore. An exploration is something that people do together, correct?

Tanner:

Correct.

Paul:

And for every exploration there must be a leader, correct?

Tanner:

Absolutely.

Paul:

And for every leader there must be a …

Tanner:

Follower.

Paul:

Exactly. So you’re implying without saying it that they’re your follower. So before we explore this or our marketing plan together. Together implies what? That you’re doing a shared activity. I just want to invite you. An invitation is something you do with someone not to someone, to share the questions, not ask the questions, but share the questions. Does that make sense?

Tanner:

Yeah, absolutely.

Paul:

That naturally arises when a great decision is being made. Now that last bit, did I say what the decision is?

Tanner:

No.

Paul:

Did I say when it’s going to be made?

Tanner:

Nope.

Paul:

Or by whom it’s going to be made?

Tanner:

Nope.

Paul:

So I leave it vague. So when I leave it vague the subconscious mind, which I’m going to repeat until people get tired of hearing it, which is the very seat of decision-making, goes, oh, it must mean I’m going to make a great decision to buy today. If I had said a great decision to buy today, the person would have given me the middle finger and hung up the phone or kicked me and where the sun don’t shine if I was in person. Does that make sense?

Tanner:

Yeah. And I really like that. I think, you know, all too often, it’s really easy to say, okay, here’s my presentation. We’re going to cover this. Let me know if you have any questions and to make things worse. You’re not standing out by doing that either.

Paul:

Correct. They’ve heard it before and you’re just making it… look, I used to tell my dating students that any communication you can put on a chart or graph or a prospectus is not going to be emotionally exciting. It’s going into the facts part of the mind. And that’s where you keep your skepticism. So I want to activate the imagination and the emotions of the other person, whether it’s dating, selling, negotiating, because that’s where the power is. That’s where the leverage is.

Tanner:

Yeah. And at what point, would you start using metaphors and stories?

Paul:

It depends on what point in the sales process I’m starting to uncover a lot of resistance. But I use more, I use metaphors and stories more when I’m teaching my clients than I teach them to use in their own sales process. You can tell a story about a client, who in a similar situation, who had success.

How do you create states of fascination, desire to believe you, a willingness to see you as their leader, a sense of relaxed trust, focus?

Tanner:

So Paul, what’s the first thing about your prospect that you need to focus on if you want to increase your sales?

Paul:

Again, what state of mind do you want them to be in? What states of mind do you want them to be in when they receive your facts, figure data, etc. How do you create states of fascination, desire to believe you, a willingness to see you as their leader, a sense of relaxed trust, focus? How do you create those states? Because again, going back to my analogy, my metaphor of the conducted medium, you can have that electricity, the best marketing plan, the best proposition, unique selling proposition. But if they’re not in the frame of mind to receive it, it’s going to go in one ear and out the other. Now there’s no video being shown in this podcast, correct?

Tanner:

Nope. Just audio.

Paul:

Okay. I am holding up one of the most dangerous things to your sale. And can you tell them what it is Tanner?

Tanner:

It is a smartphone.

Paul:

It is an IPhone to be more specific, but yes, a smartphone. Smartphones have reduced our attention span to that approximately of a goldfish. So you better also think how can I create those states of focus and those states of high concentration? Because even if your prospect starts out initially interested in what you have to say, that doesn’t mean they can’t even stay that way. Look, I remember when YouTube ads were a minute long. Now you can click off after five seconds or 10 seconds. Now back when I was, you’re a young man you’re in your thirties?

Tanner:

26, actually.

Paul:

You’re a puppy. I hate you already. You’re a pup. At 26 you’re a pup. Well, back when I was your age, we had no cell phones. There was no Instagram. There was no Twitter. There was no clubhouse. There was no Facebook, instant messaging, no texting, no you name it. So we had different attention spans than your age does.

Tanner:

Yeah. And you know, I think that’s a good point. It kind of begs the question. What has really changed about sales over the generations? Because I think the attention is an issue now. It wasn’t before, but technology also makes sales lot easier these days as well. So, Paul, how do common teachings about mindset actually get in the way of your progress?

Paul:

Again, Cantor, I have to interrupt with a story about my mother. When I was a little boy, my mother was my, one of my great teachers in my life. When I was a little boy, I was sassing my mom. My mom shook her finger at me and said, kid, if you don’t knock it off, you’re going to grow up to be an iconoclast. I said, what’s that mom? She said, that’s someone that goes around knocking over other people’s sacred ideas and really pissing them off. That’s what I want to be. I want to be an iconoclast, mommy. So I’m going to give you a completely different view of mindset.

One of the traditional things that mindset teaches is if you have a limiting belief, like I just can’t be a good salesperson, or I just can’t close the big money deals, those are common ones, correct?

Tanner:

Yeah.

Paul:

You’re to do affirmations. Like I can close the big money deals. I am a big money closer. The problem is the unconscious mind. The subconscious mind, I use them interchangeably has a hundred thousand repetitions of you believing that you can’t do it. So instead when someone comes to me with a belief that says, I just can’t be a big money closer, excuse me. I just can’t get the consistency I need. I teach them three magic words. Can I share this value bomb with you?

Tanner:

Yeah, absolutely.

Paul:

Up until now. Up until now, It was my experience that I was not a big money closer. Does that make sense?

Tanner:

Yeah.

Paul:

So that opens up the gateway. It does two things. First of all, it takes that limited belief. It binds it in time. It says, okay, it has been the case. It was the case. It no longer is the case and it gets rapport with the unconscious mind. And any battle between the conscious and the subconscious mind, the subconscious mind is always going to win. That’s just how it goes. So if you have a million repetitions of you saying to yourself, I can’t do it. I can’t do it. I can’t do it. suddenly you start saying, yes, I can. Yes, I can. You’re giving your subconscious mind the middle finger and then it’s going to shut down. But when you say up until now, you’re saying to the subconscious, yes, I understand. I’ve had this problem. I acknowledge you. Thank you for having been there as my teacher, my guide. Thank you for reminding me I need to change. I get it. Thank you. The minute you do that, the subconscious stop springing up all the negative beliefs. Cause you’ve given it what it wants, which is recognition, acknowledgement, and thanks. Does that make sense?

Tanner:

Yeah.

Paul:

So you stop, it stops fighting, then you can program it and all the good stuff.

Document what you do, make sure that it’s not personality driven so that anybody can do it and then have the right people on your team.

Tanner:

So Paul, what would you say your secrets to scale are?

Paul:

Oh, wow. Well, this is something quite frankly that I struggle with. No, not struggle. I haven’t figured it quite out myself, but if I had to do it all over again, I would not make it so personality driven. Particularly with what I do. When I taught my dating stuff, it was very much about me as this giant, over the top personality. I would say to be scalable, document everything you do. Think in the future. My coach told me, spend an hour a week, just an hour a week, thinking about how you’re going to make this scalable and into the future. So document what you do, make sure that it’s not personality driven so that anybody can do it and then have the right people on your team. One thing I’ve been good at my whole life is finding the right people to get on the bus. Before you figure out even where the bus is going to drive, get the right people on the bus. You’ve read that book. I can see.

Tanner:

I don’t think I have, but I really agree with what you’re saying. And in fact, you know, I say this all the time, but you know, my secrets to scale our processes and people. So I think we’re kind of spot on there.

Paul:

Right.

Tanner:

So Paul, I really want to thank you for taking the time to do this interview. Is there anything that I have not asked you that you think might benefit the audience?

Paul:

Easy, simple. Pick up my book on amazon.com. Here it is, Subtle Words That Sell. You can’t see it, but there’s a picture of me looking all photo-shopped and handsome in my royal blue suit. Subtle Words That Sell, the name of the book. Subtitle, How to Get Your Prospects to Convince Themselves to Buy and Add Top Dollars to Your Bottom Line.

Tanner:

Awesome, man. We’ll, we’ll make sure to link that up in the show notes. Is there any other good way for anyone listening to get in contact with you?

Paul:

Email me, [email protected] If you have any questions, I answer every email personally, and yeah, I love talking to people about this as you can tell.

Tanner:

Awesome. Well, thanks again, Paul. We’ll make sure to link that up in the show notes as well.

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